Karanlık

AI Learns Insane Monopoly Strategies

b2studios
Abone ol
görünümler 6 283 271
100% 199 000 0

all hail the brown set, and rapidly auctioning everything, according to AI at least. 11.2 million games of self-play were used to discover the secrets of this classic game

Download this AI: github.com/b2developer/Monopo...
Discord: discord.gg/KgMgeQ7EMP

katma

 

20 Ara 2021

Paylaş:

Paylaş:

Herunterladen:

Yük bağlantısı.....

Ekle:

Çalma listem
Daha sonra izle
YORUMLAR 6 554
OfficiallyNerdyGames
OfficiallyNerdyGames 4 aylar önce
***Put the raw chicken in the salad.***
Mac Henni
Mac Henni 12 saatler önce
@mil3k yes
TimeWarpDrive 77
TimeWarpDrive 77 Gün önce
it rubs the salad on its skin
Paul Rivers "Red"
Paul Rivers "Red" 4 gün önce
@Christopher Pan I've tried this and it doesn't work? What am I doing wrong? 😕
Paul Rivers "Red"
Paul Rivers "Red" 4 gün önce
@Z3DZ3R0 I've tried this and it doesn't work? What am I doing wrong?
Paul Rivers "Red"
Paul Rivers "Red" 4 gün önce
I saw that but didn't understand what it meant lol I just thought it was part of the mumble jumbo on the screen at the time lol but what does it mean tho? anything ?
Tripod
Tripod 5 aylar önce
I wanna see a full game with this AI against humans in discord.
gama
gama 4 saatler önce
@b2studios need
hellbender299
hellbender299 14 saatler önce
Bro, in Monopoly, you can enable bots in local mode, and the bots can be hard to beat, the video kinda makes no sense since they already have it
Kiidz Bop
Kiidz Bop Gün önce
You're a mad man
Mac Henni
Mac Henni 3 gün önce
@Ajakr yesssss
Tizzy Tank
Tizzy Tank 6 gün önce
Then download monopoly I play 3 AI plus me
Check
Check Aylar önce
I am somewhat of a monopoly master within my household, and everybody refuses to trade with me in fear of me ruining their lives. Browns are even better in a real life situation.
hellbender299
hellbender299 14 saatler önce
@b2studios U know AI's are already in Monopoly
RedRocket4000
RedRocket4000 Gün önce
Try Diplomacy (the game) you will probably love it and they will either kill you for real or expel you or leave the house. No luck it's rules simpler than monopoly. Making deals then backstabbing is how you win frequently as coming up with superior orders every turn with the limited options really hard. Unlike most game several versions of cheating are allowed. One I love the most is if you can sneak a new army or navy piece on the board and no one catches you it stays.
Colby Boucher
Colby Boucher Gün önce
@Ava I know that Elizabeth Maggie invented monopoly. In any case that's a pretty odd argument against land value taxation considering you can just do both (which is even more relevant of an idea now, when tech companies can make huge money with hardly any footprint, and that's ignoring day traders)
Ava
Ava Gün önce
@Colby Boucher Elizabeth Maggie was the inventor of Monopoly. And she was somewhat outspoken against land value taxation as it didn't account for the value that human labor ads. Henry George was pretty much just an inspiration of hers. That would be like crediting Steve jobs with the creation of Apple silicon when he died before that idea was ever thrown around
Colby Boucher
Colby Boucher Gün önce
@Ava *Sort of. It was a critique of land ownership, Henry George wasn't against capital itself per-se. He believed that by distributing wealth generated by the land itself equally (his idea was to do this by making a tax on the value of the land itself the only real tax), the relationship between labor and capital would become something more equitable. There's a theory that his ideas about the value of land were more or less buried by rich landowners paying economists to come up with more favorable explanations for things. Like, not in an intentional, conspiratorial way, but still. He was a fairly popular figure until his ideas mysteriously just faded away.
PicklePunFun
PicklePunFun 22 gün önce
Ai: "What is my purpose" Me: "You play monopoly" Ai: "Oh my god"
UnoriginalClips
UnoriginalClips 6 gün önce
Yeah welcome to the club pal
backelie
backelie 7 gün önce
Ai: Can't I get a mor fun job, like passing butter?
josh chuah
josh chuah 8 gün önce
Hahaha love that Rick and morty reference
10drae
10drae 2 aylar önce
id love to see a twitch account that just lets AI play against eachother on games like this and just have someone commentating throughout the entire thing
HappyHealer26
HappyHealer26 Gün önce
Not quite in the same vein but you might like salty bet. It's a 24/7 Livestream of bots fighting each other in a game called mugen
Matt
Matt 2 gün önce
Or concurrently train an AI to commentate on the games.
Bydey !
Bydey ! 6 gün önce
Chess computers playing against each other is a big thing. Pretty cool to watch.
S047
S047 7 gün önce
Golf clapping is a must
jobowisheshewasnomo
jobowisheshewasnomo 16 gün önce
@AtomicCortex demon time.
R L
R L 24 gün önce
I have only one gripe with the AI: Not only should it be winning when playing against the other AIs, it should also need to win against some control-AIs making sure that their strategy also works against other AIs that don't feat the way the NEAT AI has evolved. The way you did it the AI could still be pretty bad against a lot of players because the sample range of playing styles wasn't big enough
Filip
Filip Gün önce
Overtraining
Richard Urbanec
Richard Urbanec 3 gün önce
@Jorge Rolando Chávez Mackay Actually, their strategies are not weird. Their strategies are superhuman. They are built on the exact same foundation we already know. However, chess is an insanely complex game. And humans are incapable of thinking in such complexity. Alpha zero has hundreds of years of experience, larger computational + memory abilities and is devoid of emotion. So it finds strategies that are completely understandable from human perspective... but a human would not find them due to lower capabilities.
Emerson-Biggons
Emerson-Biggons 4 gün önce
You pay for the computers then lol
Pax Humana
Pax Humana 5 gün önce
@Seth O'Bannion , then you learn how the enemy fights and keep doing so and keep being far more destructive than them so that way, you can never get conquered.
ridethelapras
ridethelapras 5 gün önce
Tell the A.I. that.
Herobrine
Herobrine 4 aylar önce
My favorite strategy is to buy as many houses as possible, but not turn any into hotels. There are only 32 houses available in a traditional Monopoly set, and opponents won’t be able to build properties if you hold most/all of them. For this strategy, owning the browns and light blues is important because their houses are cheaper and thus you can hog more.
Robert Law
Robert Law 5 saatler önce
@twizzm It is well documented to use this strategy, and why the number of houses left in the bin is a critical factor to decide whether to build some or not.
Freddie T
Freddie T 17 saatler önce
Doesn't work
Foxxin Rox
Foxxin Rox Gün önce
@Awesomekk Me and my boys play monopoly plus on xbox like every week and this strat comes up literally every other game. The easiest set to win with is light blues, because psychologically nobody ever feels threatened by them, but they have the highest return for their cost regarding houses, so it ends up being that we trade properties so that each player gets a completed set and the player with the cheaper houses tends to win because they can more easily and safely build hotels, or easily drop down to 4 houses in order to block a new set from building them.
William Arnold
William Arnold 5 gün önce
@Sir Wabaloo My Monopoly set has excess houses so no limit, but that is against the official rules that do limit the total.
Scott Williams
Scott Williams 9 gün önce
@b2studios that's a fatal flaw in your whole simulation start over
Offbeat Onpoint
Offbeat Onpoint 15 gün önce
"we created a monolopy god and after it spent the equivalent of 1600 years discerning the ideal strategy for the game what it told us is what we already knew" 😹😹😹
guy sumpthin
guy sumpthin 2 gün önce
Not to mention, the heavy percentage of chance (roll of the dice in every play)
Know1
Know1 5 gün önce
Hey, has anyone built a computer that only answers 42 yet? If not, we better get on that.
DarkonFullPower
DarkonFullPower 2 aylar önce
One small gripe. You super glossed over that "buy orange" was human meta for Monopoly. If I knew nothing about the game, this line comes out of complete nowhere.
InitialPC
InitialPC Gün önce
@274h auctioning should be more common, most people believe you can simply refuse to buy a property and move on the rules clearly say if you dont want to buy a property (or cant buy) then an auction must take place it is not a choice
Aryan Toon
Aryan Toon Gün önce
@Sawyer Beaton I've had more wins with orange. There are 16 chance cards. Which means you have a 1 in 16 chance of going there, or 6.25%, and that's it. Rolling from jail, even just visiting, puts you at a high chance of landing on orange or red, which is why I got for those 2 properties. And that's also not true, there are plenty of other "Advance to" cards as well.
Sawyer Beaton
Sawyer Beaton Gün önce
Reds > Oranges because of the Advance to Illinois Ave Chance card makes it the highest landed on single property in the game + higher payouts than the oranges. Yellows are 3rd best and I've won many games with them. The rest of the sets don't matter. I buy them up only to trade for one of the big 3 and I always win if I can get one. Mortgage everything you have to get hotels on it and then try your best to sit in jail as long as possible. Then just wait and win.
Dark_Rit
Dark_Rit 8 gün önce
Yeah 2nd railroad worse than the 1st one because of advance to go and other cards and doubles from jail cannot land on the 2nd railroad. Though the odds of a 5 being rolled are decently high if you pay to get out of jail with 7 being most likely followed by 6 and 8. Orange having a cheap housing cost and right next to jail has always been the strength of the orange tiles. With pairs of 3 and 4 landing on orange tiles from jail too, making up 33.33% of the pairs you can roll. Last row is either decent to great with blue + enough capital to get some investment in and reap the rewards or just garbage since the green color set would have to be a pair of tiles like the blue's to ever be worth investing into considering the huge housing cost.
WorldTravel1518
WorldTravel1518 10 gün önce
@Aryan Toon Magenta is also pretty good.
Jake
Jake Aylar önce
It’s scary to think of the time manipulation that AI can have. Learning at that rate in a simulated world to impact this reality. I wonder how specific you can get with the tasks you give the AI.
CynicallyDepressed
CynicallyDepressed 17 saatler önce
The more specific the task, the better an AI is able to learn. It's when the task is vague and nuanced that an AI really struggles to develop a strategy or understand what its meant to do
David Sh.
David Sh. 3 gün önce
​@b2studios I wonder if in the future humanely-general A.I would keep the same efficiency for the amount of games it can play though, I would assume it would be able to learn with less games like human would be able to learn to play monopoly decently after a single game. also, let's say you give it a task of calculating something. obviously computers do this way faster than humans, however if it just "uses it's computer" would that be the equivalent of a human pulling out a calculator?
IceMaverick
IceMaverick 13 gün önce
​@JWCfive If you gave both sides 100 _minutes_ to learn a task, there's a good chance the AI might end up doing it better because it can use that time far more efficiently than a human could, simulating the task thousands of times in the time it takes a human to physically perform the task just once. However, if you gave both sides 100 _attempts_ to learn a task, there's a much better chance that the human will do it better, because both sides only get to simulate 100 practice sessions and a human will learn more explosively and make far more mental connections in 100 attempts than an AI would. The AIs improvement would be precise, but marginal after 1 attempt, but the human would eliminate a very wide range of possible attempts without testing them purely through prediction. Your claim was that an AI would defeat a human with "the same amount of experience", but 'amount' would imply 'number of attempts' as the metric and that statement only holds true for arbitrarily large numbers. AIs would defeat humans with the same _length_ of experience - excluding arbitrarily small numbers of time - because that brackets it under the constant of time, which is equal for both of them; the AI is simply more efficient in how it can use that time.
JWCfive
JWCfive 18 gün önce
@Totally Nothatguy this is untrue. If a human had the same amount of experience as an AI did, the difference is between the extremely precise movements of an AI vs the almost certain variations in play of a human player Edit: actually I think I see what you are saying. But if a trained AI was put up against the best player, it would almost certainly win
Totally Nothatguy
Totally Nothatguy 27 gün önce
@carlina taylor that’s because an AI can tirelessly run tons of games in a short time. If a person played a Mario course 100 times, and so did an AI, the human would win because 100 *attempts* isn’t enough to be better than humans.
Dave G
Dave G 2 gün önce
I enjoy seeing people debate a combined 1600 years of monopoly experience as if in almost twelve million games the AI didnt try everyones crappy strategies, my own included
jesse sisson
jesse sisson 2 aylar önce
You should make an AI that all of a sudden stands up, cusses out the other AI, and flips the board over. Keep it random.
Nathan Hunter
Nathan Hunter 2 gün önce
lol hahaha nice
Tyler McNally
Tyler McNally 4 gün önce
Nothing's random.
Chuck Bittner
Chuck Bittner 7 gün önce
I called that the hand of God… It's very predominant when my friends and I play risk
Bilder Burger
Bilder Burger 8 gün önce
You mean realistic
Brendan K
Brendan K 16 gün önce
Your explanation of neural networks is by far the best explanation I've ever heard. Thank you. Subbed.
b2studios
b2studios 16 gün önce
Glad you enjoyed it!
John Jackson
John Jackson 20 gün önce
"You know what better than altruism? Winning." Pretty good summary of monopoly. I'm also glad that my gut instincts to buy oranges and railroads is verified by machine learning...although they can't really account for the underhanded deals that normally take place in a Monopoly game. It might not be how the game is meant to be played, but the chaos created by random deals between players is what really makes Monopoly a fun game to play. That and free parking.
KingBarlius
KingBarlius 10 gün önce
This was my monopoly strategy for over 3 years and now everyone knows it. I've lost m crown as a monopoly champion. These 5 months have destroyed my monopoly supremacy (within the family).
Alyssa Nguyen
Alyssa Nguyen Gün önce
The longest Monopoly game I've ever played with humans was somewhere around 3 hours long. We were stuck in a protracted trade negotiation and took breaks to roll the dice. Yes, you read that right, we'd reached a point where there was more negotiating than there was (virtual since it was on my smartphone) die rolling and token moving. The game ended about 10 minutes after one of us finally gave in and made the trade the other wanted. The one who gave in and the player not involved in the negotiations at all lost.
Decentish
Decentish 4 aylar önce
It’s always nice when AI validates human strategies. Kind of reminds me of the self learning chess engines that play the same openings as human players despite learning independently.
Angel Error
Angel Error 3 aylar önce
@Hannibal why did you return to this 3 weeks later? it's already out of my head. but imo, I wasn't right but I don't think you're right either, I'd like to think that the majority of fundamental opening theory came from humans, and man sidelines probally came from humans too, I do think that computer occasionally adds new moves to theory, but the more moves, the harder it is to calculate so it doesn't have as much impact as the already established theory that humans developed. If there're any examples of openings that was made from scratch by the computer, please tell me
Hannibal
Hannibal 3 aylar önce
@Angel Error Ive worked with a good handful of Grandmasters, including some with openings named after them and they’d disagree as well, but sure, if your definition of opening theory is mainlines only the so be it. Go tell all the Benoni players that they’re playing a novelty
George Rey
George Rey 4 aylar önce
@Phil Surtees 99.999% of these possible positions are either bad, really bad or plain stupid, as they lead either to a quick loss or a stalemate. The better ones, and more difficult to find are ones that still lead to a loss after a long and otherwise perfect game. It is quite fair to say that most of the **good** ones have been actually found; some might have not been found yet but it is still fair to say that out of these 70 trillion, it is going to be hard to find one that is actually good, and haven't been found yet.
Joseph Cox
Joseph Cox 4 aylar önce
@Phil Surtees bruh, this is well written. This explanation reminds me of the video I saw about the AI that mastered Go. It (the AI) did the same thing. It made moves “that made no sense” that had devastating effect to the human much later in the game. Many Go masters’ response was summed up to “it was like a human, but also like something else.”
Colonel Mustard
Colonel Mustard 4 aylar önce
I suppose opening strategy is about providing the most potential for board coverage and access by strategic pieces and optimal opening strategies can be discovered in that way more readily (at least in computational terms) as compared to a neural network. Having not looked into it before, I am curious now if the best opening strategies bear this min/max (achieving optimal “board coverage” in the least moves) principle out versus some other strategy.
eric johnson
eric johnson 7 gün önce
One strategy that I've seen used by Dan from Game Grumps is as follows: Once you have a complete set, mortgage all properties that are in a set, shared by another player, and use that money to buy houses and hotels. Another strategy I learned from the Hard AI in Game Grumps Monopoly videos is what I call "The Housing Market Strategy". This is when a player keeps placing houses, but no hotels. The end goal is to use up all the house pieces, making it impossible for other players to buy houses.
Andy Polasek
Andy Polasek 2 gün önce
That's why human meta dictates that you should buy three houses on properties (best return for cost) and never hotels. The fourth house is for draining the supply if you get to it.
NixPanicus
NixPanicus 2 gün önce
In the first half of the video, you mentioned that the later a property comes on the board the less chance there is to land on them because of the teleports. You also mentioned the winning AI tended to have the blue properties. I think that probably explains why the brown properties were often in the hands of the winning AI, not because they contributed value to the win, but because if you get to a blue property you're very likely to also land on a brown property on the next roll.
Jackson Feddock
Jackson Feddock 11 saatler önce
I love the editing style and writing. Makes you think it’s just a typical research paper, then breaks you down with a funny joke. I love it. “You know what’s better than altruism? Winning.”
Shauryapratapsinh Barhat
The explanation about the development of the AI was awesome, it shows how well thought out it was.
Jack Nesbitt
Jack Nesbitt 5 aylar önce
The animations were so engaging and you chose a very fun topic to explore! Thanks
Jack Nesbitt
Jack Nesbitt 28 gün önce
@Mercy nope!
Jack Nesbitt
Jack Nesbitt 28 gün önce
@prod savvy no just me being nice lol, does sound a bit botty reading it back
Joshua Angelo Glumalid
@b2studios The thumbnail seems to be a little bit sus.....
Tylorean
Tylorean 2 aylar önce
@b2studios but the question is: When?
kelvin de koeyer
kelvin de koeyer 2 aylar önce
The browns are crazy, it was my dads go to strategy, cheap to buy, put houses on it quickly when others were still trying to get monopolies. We then decided to always make sure we got one of those browns as soon as we land on it
Leia Kasta
Leia Kasta 7 gün önce
One of my favorite Monopoly memories is when my younger sister bought the two lowest costing properties, built hotels on them for cheap, and then absolutely wiped the floor with the rest of us.
S047
S047 7 gün önce
Nothing but good memories. Best game was when I owned everything from Go to jail, and my grandad owned everything from jail to free parking. (We had properties scattered around too but it was impossible to keep anything from passing go) We bled the others dry with our gauntlet
King Boo
King Boo 13 gün önce
I typically gun for the Browns and Light Blues. If I can get both sets, buying houses is insanely cheap and the return is well worth the investment. Plus they have low initial rent so no one really takes them into consideration early game when trading is done
Pablo Quijada Salazar
Pablo Quijada Salazar 4 aylar önce
I love how the AI seemingly got bored and tried wild stuff like mortgaging & auctioning all its properties. Edit: *seemingly* is the key word up there
Mark Bergin
Mark Bergin 2 aylar önce
@Matt Brown youre the dope that missed the "seemingly" aspect of the OPs comment😂 Also, great to hear that we have someone in the comments that appears to have mastered understanding of human consciousness, surprised you're here and not currently presenting your findings to the other top minds in the field...
Cybernetic Argument Creator
Ai doesn't get bored, it's just randomly trying everything by brute force and when the right values go up, it uses that stuff a bit more often and then does that a jillion times. It's mindless brute force.
Neon Stream
Neon Stream 2 aylar önce
It could be that it needed to expel its accumulation, so that it could continue what it was programmed to do, play the game? I think once it had all it could get, it saw this as “not a great place if it wished to continue” and decided that selling/auctioning was the best way to get back to actually playing fully.
Andrew Barsky
Andrew Barsky 2 aylar önce
The AI realized that taking ridiculous and nonsensical decisions for the “fuck of it” payed off beyond belief. If you’re constantly throwing bizarre Hail Marys for no reason, it’s hard to defend against that.
Kat
Kat Aylar önce
thanks for explaining this so well! when you started talking about all the math and algorithms and all that, I was worried I wouldn't be able to keep up, but the animation + explanation was really helpful
Aluzky
Aluzky 3 gün önce
Make the losing AI randomly start selling all his properties for almost free to some one, just to spite the AI who is wining and make the the Ai who is in second place win. Pretty much, AI teaming to make some one lose and some one win. Then they will play realistically.
Daniel O'Sullivan
Daniel O'Sullivan 5 gün önce
I've always been a big fan of the browns and I've tended to do better when I have both of them. Players don't think much of them, so they are happy enough to trade them away which makes it easy to complete the set and then relatively cheap to upgrade.
Mana Thief
Mana Thief Gün önce
Tha'ts so true hah.
noa van der hoorn
noa van der hoorn 27 gün önce
I sometimes play 2 player monopoly with my sister, and I've had one time where we were able to say pretty early in the game that I was going to win. I had orange complete, but also had 1 of every other colour. She then found out that I was not going to trade anything, ever. I did not have houses at that point, but we knew it was just going to be half an hour of waiting it to be finished.
Charlie the AnArchie
Charlie the AnArchie 4 aylar önce
I love the part where AI learns to auction everything and bid nothing. This is genius.
Sheka88
Sheka88 7 gün önce
@backelie ​The risk of being caught will not prevent people from trying the only option they can see. It is fine to reward people for working hard, we do not all need to have the exact same income. We should all have the same or similar chances. I wouldn't even have needed to gift my brother anything to prevent the robbery / tantrum. If I'd only let something go to auction and allow him to get it for the minimum price he'd have had a way out. All I needed to do is not bid. Or even lose some more money than I strictly needed by paying fair value for it. We could have continued playing and both have fun.
backelie
backelie 7 gün önce
@Sheka88 That's a valuable life lesson; The less someone has to lose the less incentive to follow the rules. Or, put more succinctly: Inequality breeds crime.
LSW 33
LSW 33 11 gün önce
Auctioning is usually bad for the simple reason that overpaying slightly for the ability to acquire properties outside your own turn is absolutely worth it, so it doesn't make sense to give your opponents that opportunity willingly.
Merennulli
Merennulli 2 aylar önce
@allen swanson Thank you
allen swanson
allen swanson 2 aylar önce
@Merennulli Parker Brothers, actually.
Konstantin Grams
Konstantin Grams 6 saatler önce
As someone who didnt grow up with Monopoly: What is the big deal about it? Why do people find a game that is inherently frustrating and random so enjoyable? I tried it, and I found it frustrating and boring and I never finished a game.
Dtimer
Dtimer 2 gün önce
Interesting, my strategy was always to buy the pinks . I always built up the pinks so much to the point where I could easily afford anything.
ThePdog3k
ThePdog3k 2 aylar önce
My strategies in Monopoly have always been simple, I try to get the brown set (or purple I think in the states) get the red set (usually I have to trade for these), get all the railroads. If I can't get one of those for whatever reason, I'll also try to get the green or yellow properties as well.
InitialPC
InitialPC Gün önce
The reason the browns are so great is because theyre easy to land on, buy, then build houses on early in the game. While everyone else is still getting as many properties as they can, you routinely get hundreds of dollars every time they land on one of your spots right after they get their 200.
Vercusgames
Vercusgames 24 gün önce
All the best tiles were the ones I always went for when playing. I caught on pretty quick why browns are OP.
Greg Mattson
Greg Mattson 2 gün önce
I wonder if you could train better agents using some form of muzero. ie: instead of having deterministic trees, you randomly simulated different futures based off of dice rolls and cards, and came up with strategies to withhold buying specific territories with the expectation of possible, better territories to buy later down the line.
Carson Lewis
Carson Lewis 10 gün önce
My personal strategy is to first off but every property possible, even if you don't have the money, mortgage your other properties to get the money. Afterwards selectively unmortgage properties that other players could land on while mortgaging the ones they are not near to cover the cost. It's very risky and not sustainable in the early game, but pays off huge in the late game. There's also the other strategy of just cheating, but that's not as fun.
Riley Ackison
Riley Ackison 21 gün önce
I watched the whole video and laughed when the AI chose almost the same properties that I try for most regularily.
HsFearless
HsFearless 5 aylar önce
I wish there was a little more talk about the new AI's behaviour at the end, I really seemed to enjoy seeing how it plays when it becomes as good as a human player
TomLQ
TomLQ 4 aylar önce
My thoughts exactly, felt clickbaited.
Leo King
Leo King 4 aylar önce
@b2studios Yes please! This was a great video and I definitely would love to see a follow-up. Subbed either way :)
Animusic: the real life project
@b2studios or you just payed someone to code the program for you
Kyle Mart
Kyle Mart 4 aylar önce
I buy everything I land on, but strive to get the orange properties.
Olanga
Olanga 4 aylar önce
Ahahhahah
tali _m8
tali _m8 2 aylar önce
I’ve always found browns to be the underdog. If you can get both early game I find they absolutely ruin, as the rest of the players *usually* spend their starting money on the more expensive properties.
Formation 13
Formation 13 21 gün önce
If you are going to exploit human traits use the ability to not charge people.
Ripinchaos
Ripinchaos 8 gün önce
I found it weird that so many games ended in stalemate when traditional monopoly ends when all properties have been purchased and all players make it back to Go.
Sylvie Rousseau
Sylvie Rousseau 3 gün önce
Your animations are spectacular! How'd you do it? What took longer, animating the video or doing the planning, coding, and script?
Medusa53
Medusa53 Gün önce
Something this test did not take into account is the fact that during in person games, the advantage of playing like an asshole is balanced by the threat of your older siblings pummeling you.
Godowsky Godowsky
Godowsky Godowsky 4 aylar önce
One issue with mutating the entire strategy distribution is that certain strategies thrive in particular strategy distributions, and since you're measuring fitness against the strategy distribution, you can easily end up in a local optimum. In more human terms, it's possible you end up stuck within some particular meta that is good against itself.
Ethan Davis
Ethan Davis 2 aylar önce
Correct but because there are so few variables you can actually control in Monopoly, a theoretically optimal strategy wouldn't really have that much of a statistical advantage over a 'decent' strategy (humans using common sense for example)
Zorro9129
Zorro9129 4 aylar önce
@Nolan Armstrong AI is more efficient and humans have the capacity to make mistakes through their free will. Free will gives an advantage in creativity, in developing something entirely new whether it is art or philosophy. Although neural networks can simulate a new work of art, they cannot create a new form or style in the way humans like to do.
Nolan Armstrong
Nolan Armstrong 4 aylar önce
@Godowsky Godowsky but the problem is playing with humans the game is highly randomized. In the beginning of the game ppl tend to buy almost every property they land on because they have the cash on hand and the goal is to "monopolize" the board, obviously. That's why you have to think ahead multiple moves but it's also extremely risky to not acquire properties at the start of the match. Although I have found out playing conservatively and not super aggro is usually more efficient especially when playing against a wildly enthusiasticly buyer
Nolan Armstrong
Nolan Armstrong 4 aylar önce
@Zorro9129 I'd argue that free will in this circumstance would make the human less efficient than the ai. Humans also sometimes react on emotions and many variables enter playing even a simple game. For example if two humans are betting on a game I'd argue they're likely to play more conservatively. These variables don't exist with ai. Would love to hear your thoughts on this. Cheers
Nolan Armstrong
Nolan Armstrong 4 aylar önce
@Godowsky Godowsky I'd go with first semester students as I believe this is a simpler introduction they can understand and use as a template/tool going forward.
Slipknotyk06
Slipknotyk06 2 gün önce
There are so many house rules in Monopoly it's kind of hilarious. Yours differed from mine in that we could choose after going to jail whether or not to use the csrd to get out, and only rolling doubles got you out.
Tim Marrier
Tim Marrier 10 gün önce
0:42 - No, you mean to say there's an _initial overall_ chance of rolling a double that's higher over the longest stay, affording a potentially better exit strategy. It diminishes each time you don't roll a double; each individual roll having exactly the same odds of getting a double _on that roll_ (1 in 6).
Grant Verenazi
Grant Verenazi 29 gün önce
I’ve been apart of a three day long game of monopoly and it’s easily my favorite board game but boy I can’t wait to convince some unsuspecting friends to play it again and trading everything for browns 😅😅
jpaugh64
jpaugh64 Gün önce
Did you consider having this AI play against copies of itself? The auction strategy would begin to evaporate if you went even further, IMO. Although, you didn't mention an input for auction price, so I'm not sure how that would work.
Arturo Saavedra
Arturo Saavedra 3 aylar önce
I have to admit that the end of the video was a bit underwhelming for me but nonetheless I praise you for your hard effort, not just the time it took to have the data but the animation was awesome, I’m not leaving this video without a like and adding it to my favorites. Great vid :)
Icarus
Icarus 2 aylar önce
Yeah, not the most exciting ending ever. But it’s basically a science experiment, right? With hypothesis “this AI can significantly improve on typical human player strategy,” and negative results. As a young nerd-ling, I was taught that negative results are important and useful, but often under-appreciated. That description hit awfully close to home, so I resolved to give them the respect they deserve! Must’ve been more than [mumble] years ago, but ya know, I still have a soft spot for them 😂
John davies
John davies 2 aylar önce
Well I didn't really learn anything about monopoly I didn't know....I am really good at monopoly and win over 90 percent of the time and my wife has never beat me In 20 games over the years....she obviously doesn't enjoying playing as much anymore.....here are the real secrets to the game and I think most ppl do not play the auction style because that changes the game drastically along with certain house rules about free parking and how much goes in there......ppl that like to put 500 plus all the fines fees in free parking really make the game more luck based as it can be used to keep ppl in the game when thier on the verge of bankruptcy....number 1 rule when u start the game buy everything!!! At least first few turns intill your money starts to get low ...and how do you know your money is getting low?...you only need enough cash on hand to pay for the most costly rental places or cc or chance cards requirements that are currently on the board , so if no one has a monopoly yet you only need about 200 In cash to save and all that other money should be put I. Towards property........so moving on so your almost are broke but u got about 200 dollars and a few properties....u want to get a monopoly as fast as u can!!!! Whatever it takes !!!! And u wanna build fast!!!! You need to mortgage every other property and liquidate all your assets and build at least 3 houses on your monopoly....u want hotels but at least 3 houses or it isn't worth doing it. Obviously boardwalk park place are the beds property but honestly anything past the jail on the board is good enough with a hotel to bankrupt others, also the 2nd set of properties after each right turn are the better property the light blue the orange the yellow and and dark blue, houses cost the same so if you have a choice always go for the 2nd property. Also the brown properties are great to snag if you can because what they do is when your opponent goes past goes and lands there with a hotel all the money they collect will go to you and a Lil more. Now this is important because for some ppl that 200 is the only cash they have rolling in that gives them purchasing power , so taking that away with a hotel on the browns is a great strategy.
jezusghoti
jezusghoti 2 aylar önce
The end just plain sucked. I feel like I wasted my time.
dosetti
dosetti 2 aylar önce
Same here. I would've liked a chart for wins and looses and the best strategy for winning. Had trouble keeping up the fast paced speech as my superpower is limited to speaking Finnish fluently.
Ethan Davis
Ethan Davis 2 aylar önce
@Matt Brown Chess is a great use case for ML and Monopoly isn't. ML works so well for chess because the number of operations for brute analysis of a move is very big, and ML can find latent patterns to shortcut that. For Monopoly, the amount of analysis for what to do in a given turn isn't that much (or more specifically, the marginal increase of the objective diminishes quickly with the more computation you do) Which means that humans can and do perform the analysis themselves in a very short time and there isn't anything new ML can really bring to the table. I wouldn't say ML is infinitely better than brute force; there are best use cases for all types of problem solving.
Clouded Thought
Clouded Thought 4 gün önce
I always get the browns, my friends knew I called them the crackhouses and highly prioritized them. Nothing better than getting lucky and getting both early, being able to pump some money into them and then pretty consistently robbing 1-2 players from their pass go every go around.
theyetirulrs
theyetirulrs 6 gün önce
Really cool, but all share the same experiences and react logically to them. This allows for a certain level prediction. So how would it (the final iteration) change its behaviors in reaction to earlier versions of itself? Also would their techniques evolve quicker as a result of playing against a superior opponent? Great experiments frequently leave us with more questions than answers… I NEED ANSWERS LOL
Pat Russell
Pat Russell 2 aylar önce
I would love to know what is the best AI is in a 4 player game where the other 3 players were the final evolution of this vid. Like what is the best counter strategy to this one. Or is it just to fall in line and hope to chance?
Tyler Phillips
Tyler Phillips 5 gün önce
He was NOT kidding when he said to mortgage everything, I tried it a couple of times and have not even come close to losing yet! Thanks for the great tips!
Bimmy
Bimmy 2 aylar önce
The animations look like something I'd see in a bowling alley. I love it
Lost Ranger
Lost Ranger 9 gün önce
I remember playing Monopoly on the NES, when started it up- it could have up to 4 players. either 4 "PLAYERS" or 1 "PLAYER" with 3 AI or any combo. etc. one day I just put ALL AI! and just set the controller down and watched it as I ate my launch lol it was...................... interesting.......................
Osprey Au
Osprey Au 3 gün önce
It still has to be said that browns are a brutal underdog. First brown with hotel is an instant "anti go" f*** you to the poor person landing on it, and second brown is an easy 2+ houses everytime someone lands on it. Trains and Utilities are also must haves. I've won more games prioritising browns and trains then I ever have rushing down the dark blues
UnChannelDuVulpineX
UnChannelDuVulpineX 2 gün önce
0:45 No. No matter how many times you have previously rolled the dice, the odds of rolling a double will stay the same. The dice don't have a memory of what they have done.
Ryan
Ryan 2 aylar önce
"You know what's better than altruism? Winning." It seems like the bots have been given the gift of humanity.
Texan.Insomniac
Texan.Insomniac 4 gün önce
10:17
ProSportsfan1711
ProSportsfan1711 4 gün önce
Basically the bots started off playing the game like 8 year olds, then discovered that the point of the game was to prove that landlords are leaches. Nice
pgj1997
pgj1997 11 gün önce
_(AIs get smashed with a hammer)_
Mr AllenIverson
Mr AllenIverson 24 gün önce
I find it funny at the end it basically confirmed what I always try to get. Orange tiles, the others around orange, and railroads. I guess that's why I usually win. Everybody I play with goes for the blue, and greens.
Midorí
Midorí 8 gün önce
I enjoyed this a ton! Thank you so much for making this video!
LSW 33
LSW 33 11 gün önce
0:41 This is completely wrong, the chances of rolling a double don't increase the more you roll. The chance of rolling a double is always 1/6. The stats you're showing are the chances of you rolling consecutive non-doubles. For example, if you had to estimate the chance of you rolling at least one double with three trials, it would be 42.1%. This does NOT mean that if you do not roll a double on the first two trials that the probability of rolling a double on the third trial is 42.1%. It's still 16.7%. The results of previous trials do not impact the outcome of subsequent trials. This would be like saying if you flip a coin and it lands on tails, the chance of you flipping it again and getting a head is 75%, which is obviously wrong. If what you meant to say was that people who choose to pay to leave jail at earlier opportunities will land on evenly numbered properties less often than people who stay until they either roll a double or are forced to leave, then that is correct. However the way you phrased it indicates a (false) linear time relationship, suggesting that a double becomes more likely with every passing turn.
Aethelia
Aethelia 11 saatler önce
I was looking for this comment too to see if anyone was as stupid as you in intentionally misinterpreting the obvious meaning. Do you really think that the video was saying what you accuse it of saying? Do you believe it's more likely that you alone figured this out, than the possibility that your interpretation is wrong?
Lightem, Am
Lightem, Am 2 gün önce
@ZeroKitsune ​ @ZeroKitsune I was also expecting someone to have objected to this false statement. I stopped watching the video after seeing this. Programmers not knowing math? It's like a programmer who can't type - ridiculous. I suppose this will change when AI and speech recognition get better, and, as it is, most of the programming being done for business hardly requires more than a rudimentary grasp of even simple arithmetic.
ZeroKitsune
ZeroKitsune 9 gün önce
I was looking for this comment. Thank you. It may be more likely to land on even spaces if you wait to roll doubles (because you only get out if you roll doubles) but it's completely wrong to imply that the chances of rolling doubles somehow increases by waiting in jail.
Dain Dreska
Dain Dreska 2 gün önce
It probably doesn't make much difference, but the AI should also track the number of consecutive doubles all players have as their chances of going to jail could affect short term decisions.
Michigan_Supercars
Michigan_Supercars 27 gün önce
I played a Monopoly game with 5 of my friends recently and it was intense lol. Besides the fact that all of my friends are competitive, we only decided to play until one of us went bankrupt. Then afterwards we calculated our net worth and the person with the highest net worth won. Anyways, I wasn't the first to go bankrupt which made me happy. But what's interesting for me is that I got very lucky and acquired Boardwalk and Park Place on my own, and then I ended up obtaining a fully monopoly on green. These two spots are low on the landing probability thing you showed. But in our game, my friends were landing on my spots constantly lol
FreeRunner97M
FreeRunner97M 3 gün önce
As someone who works in construction, that building animation was both hilarious and on point
Yes
Yes Aylar önce
Loved the reference to intimidating the BFB with houses,and the video itself. Great job!
devinmcmanus
devinmcmanus Aylar önce
One of my favourite Monopoly strategies is to buy one property of each colour as quickly and holding on to them. This prevents other players from building houses and gives more free rolls of the dice. Did the AI try this along the way?
magicmulder
magicmulder 4 aylar önce
I would have expected an actual crazy winning strategy that showed us we *didn’t* understand the game ourselves, simply because those results are more exciting.
Sandal_Thong
Sandal_Thong 2 aylar önce
@Beardosa There's a plugin for that. 150K 👍 but only 4K 👎
Shuizid
Shuizid 4 aylar önce
It's more exciting, but unlikely. Humans aren't exactly dumb, so to be beaten by something that actually is VERY dumb, is pretty hard. AIs that beat humans usually do so by having an inherent "AI" advantage. Like being able to simulate millions of turns in seconds or just having wikipedia and thousands more websites memorized (to win Jeapordy) or just being able to consistently have several hundreds precise actions per minute (in videogames)... And they can even end up with minor flaws which simply didn't cause a losing problem but any human would quickly realize there is potential for optimization. I've seen an AI play Starcraft 2 and there is a number indicating the best number of units to gather resources. The AI always produced more. But it never lost because of it, so this trait survived.
Daniel Yuan
Daniel Yuan 4 aylar önce
@C4Oc And you'd lose all your friends only if you lose rather than if you win, which is another incentive to win the game.
Sui Sing Horace Ho
Sui Sing Horace Ho 4 aylar önce
@Seth Rose if you listened to the Deep Mind podcast, this isn’t the case. The IBM ones play like machine/alien, Alpha Zero ones actually play like very strong human player according to chess champions who played against them.
Beardosa
Beardosa 4 aylar önce
Yeah what a waste of time. Shame because I would've known instantly that the video wasn't about that if I could see the dislike button
DrewSorensenMusic
DrewSorensenMusic 2 gün önce
Did we really need an AI to tell us that owning property after the Most Frequented Location on the Board (Jail) is the winning strategy? I guess you can’t underestimate the power of human competition. A single human would take thousands of years to get to the best strategy. But is would seem human competition leads to huge leaps in learning and strategy.
Matthew Grasso
Matthew Grasso 2 gün önce
A strategy that he doesn't get into but I think important is house purchasing. The payouts always jump at the third house. If you own two monopolies, you should build one set to three houses each then the other to three houses each before building a fourth house on any.
RandomPerson
RandomPerson 22 gün önce
As someone who beat my parents and way too many friends, I can say without a doubt that this AI smart. It took me awhile to figure out how OP orange properties and especially trains are. Not paying for jail is always a good idea, because jail is protection afterall for up to three turns, you have immunity to being charged a fortune from your competitors properties.
Adrian Pugh
Adrian Pugh Gün önce
i naturally always tried to grab all or most of the trains. Its cool to see that Ai picked up on that trains its clever and makes it harder for ppl to get by without paying either for the train or property next to it.
Ohrami
Ohrami 4 aylar önce
As a person who has put an extensive amount of time into playing Monopoly quite competitively, I found this extremely compelling. I would like to ask a few questions, though: Can the AI build houses or perform trades at any time? That is, is there a separate "building/trading" phase after each turn? The official Monopoly rules do allow for this, and it's extremely important for strategy. Can I know more details of how the AI played? I would like to see examples of trades it made, for example. Would it be possible to have a human player play against this AI? Even if it's done with a primitive or even text-based UI, I would love to either play solo against 3 AI or have a group of the world's best Monopoly players play against one AI.
Jotarozee
Jotarozee 8 gün önce
@Ohrami ah i see. Its all about power, thanks!
Ohrami
Ohrami 8 gün önce
@Jotarozee Orange is the strongest but realistically with good trading most properties are equally viable if the trades are balanced properly.
Jotarozee
Jotarozee 8 gün önce
@Ohrami are there any properties that you prefer to get than others
Ohrami
Ohrami 8 gün önce
@Jotarozee It's hard to define my entire strategy because it's extremely complex. Monopoly is a very complex game where every situation is unique. Generally, you want to use your actions to maximize your leverage and use your leverage in trade deals with other players to try to gain as much power within the game as possible to make it as likely as possible to win the game.
Jotarozee
Jotarozee 8 gün önce
what is your go-to strategy?
Ingwie Phoenix
Ingwie Phoenix Aylar önce
Honestly, this monopoly game - board and environment - you used in the latter half, looks superb. Would play that!
flarebash
flarebash Aylar önce
The construction animation cutscene was easily the best part of this video. Cool research.
Ant Enant
Ant Enant 2 gün önce
Did the AI have the ability to create a strategy which adopted different behaviour at different stages of the game? i.e.: Paying to get out of jail is better early, when there's still lots of property to buy, but to stay in jail rolling later, when it's best to stay put and collect? Mortgaging properties as a priority to be first to 3 houses per property / 4 houses to block opponents later / hotels when blocking is no longer viable end-game? Over-indexing on railways and utiities early game, but underindexing on their important in late game? Monopoly is about having a playstyle which changes as the game progresses... I'm hoping the AI was flexible enough to do that?
Emmanuel Prudente
wow! this video just got recommended to me and I was absolutely not expecting it to be as hilarious as this. thanks for the effort on research about this childhood game of mine.
Jacob Huempfner
Jacob Huempfner 4 aylar önce
I loved the stories of the weird strategies and such the AIs decided to pursue, such as deciding to pay $3000 for everything and mortgaging everything. Wish there was more of that. This was a super entertaining video though! Thank you for your work!
Sandal_Thong
Sandal_Thong 2 aylar önce
I don't understand his "pay off debt to the bank" comment. Too many jokes make it hard to understand what's going on. Since you start with $1500 you can't buy anything for $3000, unless you can borrow from the bank?
Asrtyulg
Asrtyulg 2 aylar önce
I did a similar experimental a few years ago, trading was a huge pain to implement. Early on in learning I would just watch hundreds of trade offers go back and forth (usually the same deal but for 1/2 dollars more or less haha) I ended up limiting trade offers heavily in the number that could be made
Asrtyulg
Asrtyulg 2 aylar önce
I should release the results of training sometime...
Sonraki
Beating BTD6 with AI
10:40
görünümler 1 200 000
Automatic pool stick vs. strangers
21:19
görünümler 18 000 000
Could 2 People Actually Repopulate Earth
13:59
I programmed some creatures. They Evolved.
56:10
Coding Adventure: Chess AI
29:22
görünümler 2 200 000
HOW TO WIN MONOPOLY EVERY TIME
9:52
görünümler 2 400 000
The Hardest Climb of Trackmania
8:32
Monopoly Turn 1 Victory
26:40
görünümler 4 600 000